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The God particle

 
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Klatu
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 16, 2004 3:40 pm    Post subject: The God particle Reply with quote

Howdy!

I found this interesting little tidbit while googlin around today.

I thought it might be worth posting for the questions/answers it would create.

http://www.freewebs.com/thegodparticle/

K
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lg
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 23, 2004 5:53 am    Post subject: The God Particle Reply with quote

Well..hmmm. Thinking, thinking. One of my first impressions to the neurons/DNA usable comment, was the fact that we know how little of our brain we actually use. So, there could be a connection to the DNA/neurochemical transmission thing. If we used every single part of our brain, would we be 'God smart'? I've simplicistically always thought of the small part of our brain usage like a fuel tank on a car; if we were 'full', I don't think we'd be here at all. We need to learn, so we come here to do that, with our brains having plenty o' space for the learnin'. As it is, we keep unfolding the petals of life, 'discovering' things (still understanding there are no new things, simply new applications), communicating these discoveries, hoping to enrich life for all. (This is where Tims' mentoring question comes in...say, we have something here in this place and share it with others in another place. But they are not into using that part of the brain, because they are still using a different part we may have left behind, or not yet gotten to. So, no matter the sharing, the acceptance cannot be, due to proper evolutional unfolding. ) Simply put, if you put a child in an adult role, they'll look around and mimic the adults, but the understanding isn't there, and you end up with a really confused child. But knowledge cannot be boxed and saved like a future present. So, out it leaks, and what the mind will do with it, is anybody's guess, but not necessarily anybody's responsibility. Unused portions of things, be it brain space, DNA, or a carafe of oil and vinegar, are there because someone, something created too much for the immediate use. Okay, so I've decided I like the God Particle explanation. Anyone else willing to bite this apple?
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lg
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PostPosted: Sun May 30, 2004 8:37 am    Post subject: God Particle Reply with quote

Have any of you read this? Its really good, and thought provoking. I'd like some discussion on it, other than myself! Would you?
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Bh



Joined: 22 May 2005
Posts: 3

PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2005 9:36 am    Post subject: the God particle... Reply with quote

Why must God only exist in a fraction of time. Why must we conlude, the universe will eventually impload, and re-expload. The "big bang" is a widley acceptable theory, but not a proven fact. I agree with many of the author's thoughts on "the God particle", and entertain the theory as possible. But, why does it matter?

I believe the focus of importantance is knowing what God "is", not how God was created, unless we are striving to create more Gods.

An example: why couldn't God's origin simply be particles of energy which joined, and eventually became "intellegent".

Could it then be concluded, God is simply "Intellegent Energy".

Bh
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Klatu
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PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2005 2:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gh,

However we percieve God, it is only a mental construct that we invent that allows our finite minds to grap a concept that is infinite and at the same time subjective.
Even the God particle is a construct of possibility, a poor hypothesis at best with no facts to accomidate it.

If God were an intelligent form of energy, electricity might be banded from use out of fear or respect... much the same way Buddists respect all life forms so as to not even step on an ant for fear/respect it might be a long lost relative.

The universe is an expression of the creator... not the creator him/herself. From this expression we could conclude that God desires to share a relationship with us to contemplate this wonderful and endless expression.

It is said that God exists in all things everywhere at the same time, if this is a fact then he is one or all of the nuclear forces we now know of, in this case splitting atoms and moving electrons would be the sins to avoid.

In this same vane, is physics the new or ultimate religion? Heir Einstien thought so.

When we pass to the next form of life, perhaps we will come to know the truth concerning these and other interesting questions.

For now, we must work with what we have.

K
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lg
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PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2005 5:12 am    Post subject: response Reply with quote

Hi, K...In our lifetime, the scientific uncoveries have been profound. Remember when man was on the moon, and "here's this crater, and there's that rock, and look, you can't really live up here"? Before that, there were cheeses, faces, etc. but not 'us'. Since we've 'been there', you don't hear those fairy tale things about the moon. The moon is now about science and fact, and such. So, I think science changes everything, including our hearts. Still, it does not shred us up with everything at once. The uncoveries come a bit at a time. There is a Cosmic Kindness in that, I believe. Maybe, one day, everything will be known for man on Earth, and that everything will just be fact. Like you said, until then, I guess we'll just hop the train to the next station....L.
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Pbody



Joined: 19 Aug 2005
Posts: 4
Location: Los Angeles

PostPosted: Sun Aug 21, 2005 7:25 pm    Post subject: Pbody's response to the God Particle article.... Reply with quote

Greetings and thanks for the article reference. I get the feeling that this article mirrors the evolution of man's (reCreation) of himself, by drawing conclusions where there is no reason to do so. What this means is that the pursuit of an origin is rather fallacious considering that we ignore our inconsistencies and contradictions in order to be correct! Using electricity as an analogy, a belief is either positive of negative but never neutral. Nuetrality though is the only 'place' where prespective may be gathered!

Further, the entire article presumes that our interpretations and laws and principles and beliefs etc. are correct, or at least a viable starting point. Maybe there is no choice but this sets up a dilemma and ultimately a paradox. If we ignore the fact that there is always clearly more than we could know in any thought or instance, then we narrow our perspective, and our expression of that persepctive in order to describe the whole, including God, which is logically less than God's presence logically encompasses. A paradox so why keep trying? Hmmmm! Is there not a way to get enough distance, presumably from ourselves, to see the big picture more clearly, even if the lessons learned are not available to us until we grow up a bit more, say a couple million more years of evolution, generally speaking? What's the hurry?

The article states, "Everything in the Universe boils down to energy." That statement is itself an ironic statement regarding the process of aquiring truth. To 'boil down' means to reduce a consideration to something essential. In philosophy this is known as eidetic reduction, where the truth, like wine, is a distilled essence to which nothing can be added and from which nothing can be removed to retian the core essence of some alchemical concoction. Considering that our most notable interpretations of Nature now accept that everything is energy and energy is in constant motion rather than the former Newtonian, mechanically fixable version, no intellectual construct could ever do more than point at some unfolding condition of being, dare say that some collection of 'boiled down' words could represent some eternal singularity. Therefore, boiled down is itself a logical fallacy, in no way shape or form an origin, and at best a belief.

My personal view of the God particle is that all is in motion, all is in a state of harmonious readjustment, and that every system must have a still center; the ingredients of a tasty God sandwich hold the mayo! Look for the ingredients, not unlike DNA, and through the relation to the form which therefore exists somewhere, and the ingredients, the relationship points at the etenity we so desperately seek. Our langugage and bodies must expand into to better comprehend! The nearly 5000 year old Chinese langugae considers context and words meaning changes accordingly. The West aspires to a intellectual confidence wherein our words and ideas sre thought to remain quite fixed as if our ideas are hell bent on replacing the Natural ones! Nature will win. Why fight? Finally harmony has become a consideration.

The relationships suggest that God is the stillness around which both energy and matter resonate, and though the word 'center' suggests a position, this sort of Center is an ever unfolding state of being that merely agrees with the movement of the dancing matter and energy. What consititutes movement in both the Newtonian world and the Quantum is antagonism. Amazingly though and contrary to any intellectual construct, energy is not contiguous. The simulataneous expression of that energy as matter is so we continue to manage the results and not the dynamic process. No wonder we want to know how we arrived here so terribly; our intellectual DNA ignores the process in order to define the results! Think about it, we know that when energy slows down, it sticks together. What few know is that matter is held together via resonant frequencies which for me is no less than the feeling of love; the dense core of an eternal being - the true essence of all that exists - unknowable as a limitated expression. What we may know is that existence certifies that energy has coalesced into something material (all things come from 'Nothing' mind you), and that through the metaphysical law of symmetry, there is a balance between the inside and the outside of things such that the outside is physical and the inside remains in a state of etheric energy. We can extend our imaginatation from the conclusion out into the universe as our technolgies have done thus far, but, it is my view hat the source if not the technology but human biological, the most advnaces intelligence in the universe and even mopre intelligent than God because we have a voice and choice, eternity does not! We so often forget that we too have immense responsibility and defer the fault to God who gets built right into and blamed for every damn thing including the God particle!

It is my view that our bodies, not our ideas or laws of principles, are the expression that we seek and to understand this better is the elevation of awareness that will hopefully relax our intellectual dependence. Truth guys and gals is first felt! We make up our minds and God agrees.....We are the origin of movement!

"We must let go of rules, rules like gravity!" - The Matrix
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Fascination



Joined: 14 Sep 2005
Posts: 5
Location: Scotland

PostPosted: Wed Sep 14, 2005 4:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

From the start of this paper I had already began to harbour doubts. As he lists his points from which he expands upon, its noticeable that the majority of them dont actually have any research based facts behind them.

The God Particle wrote:
Due to point 5, a particle with the power of God MUST come into existence at some point.


This would imply that the universe has an infinite amount of time which is something we arent entirely sure upon yet, though some theories dictate that this if of course utterly wrong. Wink
Later on in his essay, he mentions the heat death theory which of course removes the possibility of an infinite amount of time.
The general gist is a collection of different scientific theories, coated with a nice big dollop of religion.
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lg
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2005 8:17 am    Post subject: response Reply with quote

I LOVE it! An article has created intelligent discussion and personal thought patterns that expand each of us who thinks about them.

The world has always benefitted from great thinkers, adequate thinkers, and a lot of questioners. As a friend once asked me, when she told me about some rock that grew some wierd type of fungus: "Why do you ALWAYS want to know why? Can't you ever just accept things as they are?" I guess not. It's personal education. None of us, no matter how logical, have anothers' truth.

I'm enjoying the conversation...
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self
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2005 4:44 am    Post subject: grats Reply with quote

Klatu; congratulations on presenting something that has had over 400 views! Making us think about something is always a goods thing. Thanks!
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Pbody



Joined: 19 Aug 2005
Posts: 4
Location: Los Angeles

PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2005 11:02 am    Post subject: Multiverse Reply with quote

Hello all once again, the multiverse is a more appropriate term than universe as well this challenges the basic tenets of Western thought which always reduce ideas to singularities as a measure of their validity and scietific truth. Facts are considered facts when they meet this criteria! The trouble is, as Quantum physics has shown us, that singularities are unstable and unpredictable and maintain an inherent wobble if you will as the constituent energies continue to move and shift from their center. It is curious that the faith in the scientific process continues to compel us to resolve singular ideas about multiphasic phenomena of the multiverse. The 'God Particle' sits at the pinnacle of this category of intellectual considerations. Maybe God herself has many many faces..... It's very interesting to consider any idea within this variable persepctive.
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lg
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 23, 2005 6:51 am    Post subject: response Reply with quote

Ahh, Pbody grasshopper...yu peak like a twue westana...

My personal belief system is a combination of many thought systems, 'Eastern' being big on the list. I thought (that) fact was why I could entertain the God Particle. When I see a prism I understand its composition and facets, but every now and then the blue is just pretty to look at, you know? Or the green, maybe, and so on. I don't want to miss the wonder because I understand the refraction...singular contemplation is sometimes good for the soul...

Heah a wobba, deah a wobba, eweweah a wobba wobba...
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AncientHart



Joined: 18 Jul 2005
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2005 5:49 am    Post subject: Reply to Ig - Re: Using 10 percent of brains. Reply with quote

This idea that we only use 10 percent of our brains has been around for quite a long time. It's also not entirely accurate.

Scientist tend to believe that we only use approximatly 10 percent of our brains at a particular time! That's because most of our brains is made up of storage space. When we're doing any type of thinking, we're only calling upon the areas of memory that are relevent to the task, or are triggered by associations with the task. (The smell of my grandfather's old shirts bring up memories of safety and comfort.)

However, most of our brain gets a good workout over the course of a year, because specific memories seem to be spread out throughout the brain. I can't point to a part of my skull and say "This is where my memory of my first grazed knee is stored."

A related topic is the idea that we never forget anything that we have experienced. This idea is true. When scientists first started working with brain operations with conscious patients, they found that when they poked certain places, the patient reported experiencing long-forgotten events in very vivid detail.

There was a science fiction short story I once read where the main protagonist volunteered to take a memory-recall enhancing drug. Afterwards, he found that he could solve all sorts of problems simply because he could freely recall so many small incidents and facts. However, his general intelligence hadn't been increased by the drug.
He used this ability to decypher the reality behind the company's internal politics, and made a bid to take the company over. But because he was only of average intelligence, he didn't forsee that this would cause his supervisor who was in charge of the drug-test to attempt to forciblly apply an antidote.
The story ended when the main character stated that the shock of the forced antidote-administration attempt had caused him to lose his super-recall ability. His wife, who was much more intelligent than he was, found out that he still had this ability, and told him that this time, he was going to keep it a secret, and he was going to listen to her about how to use the ability.
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ShellyH



Joined: 04 Oct 2010
Posts: 9

PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 11:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That article about God's Particle really shaken my brain, I find it hard to understand what it say. Well, I will read it again, to understand better. But I would say it's a good piece.
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Amy Tucker



Joined: 18 Nov 2010
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 19, 2010 7:47 am    Post subject: God particle is meaningless Reply with quote

I don't really believe in this theory. I think God's particle is a meaningless thing. God is there from the very beginning and will be there for ever and deserves a different concept to being explained. Let's look at God as the creator of all things & not being created being 1 & unique in its form and concept which we humans can never know until we die & meet GOD.
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